Something New Every Week
Something New Every Week
Exploring the Transformative World of Art Therapy and Photography with Carly Sullens
Ready to embark on a journey into the transformative world of art therapy and photography? In our latest episode, we sit down with Carly Sullens, an accomplished photographer who has taken her background in art therapy and used it to forge a unique path. Carly invites us into her world, as she paints a vivid picture of the profound ways in which art, and specifically photography, can serve as a healing tool. Through her inspiring work with children in hospice, Carly takes us on an emotional journey that underscores the power of imagery in storytelling and the magic of capturing moments.
As our conversation unfolds, we venture into the fast-paced, ever-evolving world of composite art and digital photography. A realm where Carly beautifully blends her skills to create a form of art therapy for her clients. We explore how the creation of composite art offers infinite possibilities for expression, and how important it is to sometimes let go and create art for its own sake, without the commercial aspect at the forefront. We dive into how Carly's innovative approach has allowed her to incorporate her love for digital art into her photography business, setting her apart in her field.
The exploration of creativity doesn’t end there, as we delve into the world of reportage in dance and its importance to all artists. Carly shares valuable insights into how personal inspirations and preferences can shape your unique artistic voice. With her passion for teaching practical techniques for creating painterly composite images and her unique approach to senior portrait work, Carly embodies the power of personal expression in art. So, tune in, get inspired, and join us as we journey through the world of art and photography on Something New Every Week.
So, are you ready to see the world through a different lens? Grab your headphones, and let's dive into this fascinating world together!
Hey there, thanks for tuning in to Something New Every Week with your host, me, jason Group. Each week, I'm going to give you something new that's happening in our photographic world just some great conversations with my friends and what's going on right now. Something New Every Week is sponsored by Miller's Lab. Miller's Professional Imaging is the largest professional lab organization in the United States. They provide professional prints and press products for professional photographers in all 50 states and Canada and they're just a great company. If you don't know them, go check them out. Millerslabcom. Another episode of Something New Every Week. This week I'm solo. No jackie-tobin. This week I am solo with my friend and neighbor, carly Sullins. Carly, say hello.
Speaker 2:Hello.
Speaker 1:Carly, I think, is a little nervous today, and so we're going to put out warm vibes if you're listening out there, even though you're not going to have anything to do with this. But anyway, I'm trying to relax her. I'm probably just making her more nervous, but I'm thrilled to have her here today. Carly is a super duper talented photographer, is really good with. We're going to talk about her post-production work and other things like that and some of the stuff that she's working on, but before we begin, I really want to talk about where we're going to have lunch this afternoon before we even start.
Speaker 1:Because you know that's the most important thing in my day right now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the last time we had lunch together, do you remember? You called me and you're like I have something to tell you. I got COVID. Oh, that's right, I forgot about that.
Speaker 1:Who's that lunch at? Yeah, I must have just gotten back from Portland, because that was the last time I've had COVID for the third time, and yeah, so we haven't had lunch. Anyway, carly lives in just south of me in St Louis and we don't see each other nearly enough, but I'm looking forward to having some lunch today. I think Nubby's barbecue is by you.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, we could meet there, for sure. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Nubby's. I get my haircut right next door, so that place is always good.
Speaker 1:Anyway, all right, let's not talk about lunch. We can talk about that after we're done. Now, carly, I don't know your early history and this podcast's are about getting to know you as a photographer and I always love the origin story and, sorry, my video keeps cutting out the origin story about how you got started and kind of like that. So let's start at the very beginning, when Carly first picked up a camera, what that spark was and all of that. Take us to the beginning.
Speaker 2:Okay, I think my beginning starts earlier than the camera it starts. I always felt art and art making photography has a profound connection with ourselves and others. I believe that intuitively, without understanding it, when I was creating art as a young age and in high school, and that led me to study art therapy in undergrad.
Speaker 1:Oh right, I forgot about that, okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I went to a small school in Ohio called Bowling Green. It was only one out of two undergrad art therapy schools in the whole country. I didn't know it at the time, I just walked into it, but it expanded my mind and Carly drove in the point that our art making, either painting or photography has profound impact and has the ability to really connect us with others. It breaks down like language barriers. When you show an image, I don't have to know what language you speak. I can understand and receive that image.
Speaker 1:That's super interesting, and I think you're the first person that I've ever interviewed that has an art therapy background, and which is surprising, because in our industry you would think that that would be something most of us would gravitate towards in that world. You're also one of the few people that is somewhat art educated and has some sort of education in photography or art in general. So tell me, did you so? You may or may not have gotten a degree in art therapy. Did you work in that field at all?
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, after undergrad I went on and got my master's, because you have to get your master's to practice as an art therapist.
Speaker 1:Wow Okay.
Speaker 2:Yep, that actually was here at SIUE outside of St Louis, yeah, yeah. And then I worked at several places. My favorite was hospice, where I helped greeting families particularly the children. Adolescents understand grief and loss and we had a great art room. People would donate art supplies and it was a great place for the children to express this profound loss that they were having either a parent dying or a loved one, and the art just became this language for them that they may not have the words to articulate how they're feeling or totally understand.
Speaker 1:Wow, I can't imagine doing that kind of work. It sounds super duper heavy and I'm sure that those kids must have gotten a lot out of that. So I'm curious the exercises that you would have them do does any of that translate to adult work or things like to help you with your own grieving? I don't know where I'm going with this question, but I think you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:So a child could do a collage of their loved one, so using the photography and making a memorial to remember them. Because as children age, they grieve in different stages. At five-year-olds the grief is a 12-year-old. They understand that differently and as adults we can look at our photos. So my photography is so important and imagery is so important. It helps connect us to our own memories and our own stories. But even so, like the image behind you, I don't know the story behind those images, but they connect with me in some way. Our art is ourselves, like a personal story, but it's also ability to communicate with others. We all have profound loss in our life. We all have had difficult moments and great moments.
Speaker 1:Well, that does make a lot of sense. And yeah, so the pictures behind me are it's a plaque from Rangefinder for when I had a couple of articles about my work in Rangefinder, and they are very personal to me and my loss is that I don't live in New York City anymore, so it's always there behind me.
Speaker 1:On the right here or left, whatever's on your screen is my Guinness Book of World Record, oh, which I can tell you more about that at lunch. I'm sure that I've discussed it before, but I do have a Guinness Book of World Records for the most camera flashes ever used to make a photograph.
Speaker 2:That's what the record is for oh wow, yeah, wow, I didn't know that, well, this isn't about me, it's about you.
Speaker 1:But yeah, these are definitely very personal things to me, and that over my shoulder there is an actual figure of me that somebody made for me. Oh, is that a bobblehead? It's a bobblehead, yeah, yeah, anyway. So you did art therapy master's degree in art therapy. There's not a lot of us who have gone that kind of continuing education in our field and then you decided you wanted to be a photographer instead.
Speaker 2:No, it kind of wayward. I became a mom. I had the privilege to put my career on hold to raise my children. Not everyone has that privilege, but I did. And then I take pictures of your kids and I just fell in love with it. And photography was a difficult art medium for me to pick up. It did not come easy at all. I had dyslexia, so it made it really really hard.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I can imagine and it's funny there, you're not the first photographer I've met that has dyslexia and I don't know what it is about that that makes photographers or creative people gravitate towards this medium, but that's something that I've seen quite a bit. So okay, so you're a mom, you're dabbling with your camera and, like many moms that I know, all of a sudden there's a spark. I wanna do this and make money at it. Am I in the right direction?
Speaker 2:Well, people kept asking me can you take our family photos? I'll pay you? I'm like no, I don't wanna do that. But once you hear that enough, you're like huh, they go to pay me. Okay, maybe I'll give it a try. And that's how I got my feet going in there.
Speaker 1:Okay and so but my background in art therapy.
Speaker 2:We had to choose a medium, an art medium to fully study. It could be sculpture, it could have been photography. I chose painting and I loved painting so much and I gave that up when I started my family. And once I started photography, it wasn't taking the images at first that excited me, it was the post-editing, because that put me back in a seat where I was most comfortable.
Speaker 1:Right, and I know that you spent a lot of time and I know that's been kind of a second love for you is moving into that painterly things. But I don't wanna go there yet. I wanna talk about you as a photographer. I'm trying to drag this out of you, I know, but so in your photography business it was mostly family stuff and seniors, right.
Speaker 2:Yes, seniors, families, pets, anything with eyes. I like portraits.
Speaker 1:Right, anything with eyes that's a good way to describe the portraits and then you've kind of combined those two mediums right. So you took your photography work and then you started taking your paint experience and painting experience and kind of combined that into Photoshop and working in that medium as well. Talk to me about how you started combining those things.
Speaker 2:I think in the beginning I was just a horrible photographer. I didn't understand it and, like I said, the dyslexia and light ratio and there's a lot of math in this art medium. But I knew how I wanted to articulate the image. I knew where I wanted to go. I just didn't know how to do it in camera yet. But I knew if I played around with Photoshop enough, maybe I could fix something. And then that's when I realized I can go beyond fixing it. I could smear those pixels as much as I want and paint it.
Speaker 1:Right and you've been very successful in a lot of contests and competitions as of late with that work and congrats to you on that. You did very, very well at the Missouri PPA this year. I don't remember how many awards you had, but I do remember you walking with this like literally armful of stuff that you got. Talk to me about those awards.
Speaker 2:Yeah, as I think as we grow and mature as photographers and we start finding our own stride, it takes a while. Once you get there, people start recognizing that as well. So my creative art and photography is sticking on its own new kind of level, kind of beyond painting the pixels, I've kind of been blending layers, playing with layers a lot and blending modes and opacity and just kind of see where does it go. I'm more of a process oriented creator, and that I mean I don't always know where the edits going to go. I don't always have a final thought of, okay, I want it's from here, I want to get to there. I kind of say, okay, it's here, let's see what I can do, what can I add, what can I blend, what can I change, what can I take out? And then the art takes on its own revolution.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you know, but I always, you know, with this kind of work, I'm always like finding where you're going to start with this and then where you wind up, and I think that's the art. That's where the art comes in. As far as painting is concerned. You start with something and you know it's that ability to let go, which photographers don't normally have that much, right?
Speaker 2:I see your face and I'm like oh.
Speaker 1:Well, I'm looking at your website now and I'm like one of the first images that I see is of a it's a bird's nest with some eggs in it and there's a lot going on there and I'm like, how do you get from here to here? Is always kind of a thing where, like you know, when I go to go to photograph a lighthouse, I'm going to take a picture of a lighthouse and I want to represent that in its form, using, you know, whether it be black and white, using the different different mediums within photography, or representing it in a certain way. But then, with the skills that you have, you're taking it to a whole other level.
Speaker 2:Definitely, and there's room for both.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:In a photography world, I think you know there's people like, like repertoire. This is how it's supposed to be, this is how it's depicted, this is what it is and I have the utmost respect for that and I love. Besides the digital realm and creating that way, repertoire is my other favorite, because then you're not editing as much and the goal is to try to get that image rate in the moment and tell the truth of the story right there.
Speaker 2:Right, but then there's a whole spectrum. You can come all the way here and take that lighthouse, extract it from the background and put it on the moon, and then maybe on the moon you have someone crocheting. Like this is like me just creating, like maybe she's crocheting and her knots are coming down to the earth and there's a child swinging, and you could create this whole other story.
Speaker 1:Right, and that's that's really I mean, because some of your stuff it's hard for me to tell whether it's a photograph or it's just become a painting at that point.
Speaker 2:And they're almost like watercolors. Hold those in it. They all have some sort of photography in it.
Speaker 1:Right and okay. So I'm new to this process. Where do I start?
Speaker 2:Well, it's called composite art or digital art. There's a lot of emerging composite artists out there and as our digital revolution of photography continues to change and grow I mean it is growing and leaps and bounds right now this is going to become more and more part of our, our editing process for those who choose it. Not everyone's going to choose it, and that's okay, but it allows for more possibilities. It allows for more depth and more complex complexity in our artwork as our editing tools get more sophisticated.
Speaker 1:Right and I'm super jealous of your, your, your skills in this area too, like the amount of time that you've, you've dedicated to this.
Speaker 1:I, I'm super jealous and the fact that you can and I've seen you do it take, you know, a piece of this and a piece of this and then bring it together. Where I'm like super old school, all I want to do is create one image and maybe touch it up a little bit and stuff like that. And I, you know, I'm looking at your Facebook page here and I see how, like, you have a senior portrait I think it's a senior portrait of a girl, a teenager, who has purple hair, and you've photographed her out in a field with purple flowers and you've kind of created these, these composites, together. I love the way you, you know, combine these things together and, you know, use these for your clients to see another one where you've taken flowers and the skin tones are the same and things like that. Talk to me about how, like, how you're you're combining that in your business, as far as you know, working with your clients.
Speaker 2:I actually kind of keep it separated when I'm working with clients. I actually bring in my art therapy in that I like to work with clients that are a little more shy, a little more harder to open up maybe not the one that's looking forward to their senior pictures. I like the ones that are like I want to do this but I'm not so sure and really allow them to open up in the space with me, especially the one with the purple hair. That's what that one. It took her a while to open up with me, but at the end she just enjoyed the process. In my other, the Carly Selling digital, digital artistry that is, teaching people how to do this, how, if you want to take your photos and move it beyond into something more artistic, you could do that too, and there's a place for you to do that. You could do it for your own. You don't always have to monetize your art and your photography, and I think that's something that we don't hear in our industry very much. You could create just for you.
Speaker 1:What I'm all about the dollar. I'm a New Yorker, no, no, I totally agree with you, and I think that one of the things that I've learned earlier in my career is the taking the time to do work for yourself is so important, because, in general, the work that you do for yourself is what leads you to the work that you get paid for, exactly, and I see that in your work quite a bit.
Speaker 2:Thank you, yeah, and a part of me had to step away. Like, this is my client work and this is I would do, the really good photography I developed that I got certified as a professional photographer so I could learn really how to do lighting and how to pose and do all the good things. And then over here I needed my own world where I could just sit back and process and play with Photoshop without worrying how is the client going to like it, and I wanted to separate that so I could truly explore the limits for myself.
Speaker 1:I love that. I love that. I want to kind of break that down a little bit more because you know you come from, you're trained, you know you have a master's degree in art and you know these things, where you've learned how to take projects and put them together, and I definitely want to talk about the business that you've built for teaching and educating and all that. We're going to get there because it's super-duper important. But I think it's really like what I want to hear and this is for me personally, when we're working on projects and we're exploring where we want to go. I just kind of want to get in your head a little bit about, like, when you decide you want to work on something, like, is there like a pencil and paper I write down where I want to go? Is there some sort? Because there's got to be processes involved. I've seen the way you've worked and projects that you've done. Do you know? I want to get in your head a little bit about that, yeah.
Speaker 2:There's a great word in dance called your repertoirege, and that's the different dance movements are going to do for this particular song, and I think, as artists and creators, we need to be aware of our repertoirege. As my background in art therapy taught me, is that certain images, certain things are going to gravitate towards me and certain images are going to gravitate towards you. We could go out for a walk or scroll through Instagram. You're going to stop at something different than I'm going to stop at, and sometimes we'll stop at the same things. Universally. There's a universal art language. Some things are just going to resonate with multiple of us, but these little intricacies, these little differences, are what's going to make you unique and your art and your point of view unique, and what we need to do is become aware of that.
Speaker 2:What am I gravitating towards? What do I like when I scroll Instagram, when I look at Pinterest? Do I like urban photography? Do I like landscape photography? Do I like portraits? And what is it? Ask yourself the questions. What is it that is gravitating me towards this image?
Speaker 1:Exactly, but I'm curious. So, for example, when I was working on my commercial portfolio for many years, I would take specific chunks of time and just dedicating it to specific things that I wanted and, just like you said, I looked for some inspiration. I'd create some sort of board for myself and then I'd kind of unpack that and then barrel through my ideas. Is there something similar in your world? You work on a lot of personal projects, so that's kind of what I want to hear about. Like the shot with the eggs. Just unpack that for me deciding to do that shot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think a lot of my work, and I think why I had so many awards this year, is that I allow more of my personal story to leak into the imagery and not shy away from those personal stories, whether they were hard or good or bad. I'm not the label them with words, but just they are what they were. And how can I depict this visually? There's this one image I don't think you've even seen it, it's not up yet because I have it in a contest right now of this woman in the field and she's holding a ladder up, and above the ladder is this space. There's nothing there, but there's birds above that.
Speaker 2:So there's this negative space and then birds Like where is she going? If she could go up in this ladder, if she go into the sky, if she reached in the birds? Is she trying to connect? There's a different realm in the world, and I think I'm someone that has experienced a lot of loss, like a lot of us has, but I'm always trying to reach for something, reach for that connection, and I may not have that connection with what I'm trying to have.
Speaker 1:That's the tortured artist in all of us, right, never reached that connection. That's what keeps us going, yeah for sure. Yeah. And one of your newest not newest but newer passions in the last several years has been teaching and sharing this medium that not a lot of people do, in educating other photographers on how to do what you do. Recently, I know you spoke at ClickCon right, that's the last place you were at and I know that you have a membership website or you have an educational website, which I share all of that in the show notes here so you guys can go check it out. But talk to me about teaching.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love to teach. I love to teach not only the principal practical steps of how to do collage art or composite art, but I also want to teach more about the internal passion you have. Like, allow some of that art therapy background to meet others. Don't just put art there, art out there, just because you want it to look good. We need art, especially now, since there's so much out there that has meaning and impact, and allow people just to have the space to breathe that in, like who you are now and what do you want to say.
Speaker 1:Right, let's talk a little more technical though. Talk about what you teach in those classes. Let's get into nitty gritty. Tell me what you teach me.
Speaker 2:I want to teach people how to make their photos look painterly without having to paint the pixels. So you can actually make a photo look painterly by just giving a painterly background and learning how to blend those two letters together.
Speaker 1:Compositing, you mean Compositing. It's like a four letter word for me.
Speaker 2:It's more than four letters.
Speaker 1:It's a lot more than four letters, which is what I'm usually doing when I'm trying to make my own composites. All right, and again we'll share that with you. But I want to get back to your senior work here because again I'm on your Facebook page and I'm looking at some of these A lot of times you're kind of featuring three images. They're not really triptychs, but they're kind of three images in each one of them and I could tell there's a process here that you're putting together in that. And what I love about the work is that you're featuring these kids and I'm trying to put my words together here.
Speaker 1:But, like the locations are not, they're atypical, they're not like in Forest Park in St Louis. They're in kind of one location, whether it be some landscapes, but they're close, and then they're far but they're really featuring these kids. So, for example, like one of them is on a dirt road and she's kind of flipping her hair up, and then there's another one that's close and then there's another one from her behind walking away. I'm still here and it's super duper interesting, because none of them actually feature her face close up. But it describes the kid in three photos and I love it. They're neat. It's very, very different. And can you talk about that process a little bit?
Speaker 2:Sure, I tried to make sure I nail the shots they want. First they want a portrait smiling, a nice body pose. I get all those shots down, but then I allow myself to play in a session with a child and I really feed off the child, the adolescent, their energy, who are they? As they are expressive. And one thing I keep in my head, a phrase, is if I could tell the story, the whole story, in just a moment, how would I capture that moment? And it doesn't have to be their face, it could be.
Speaker 2:I was just doing a senior photo last week and he wanted his truck in the photo. We had him sitting on the back of the truck and then he was gonna go inside and right when he jumped down and I go, why don't you go sit in the driver's seat? He was getting ready to close the tailgate and I just caught that hand in the tailgate, something that he probably does all the time, but it's just zooming in on that one little piece of who he is. And that's exactly what I'm talking about, like there in this one shot of a girl blowing a bubble.
Speaker 1:And then the next shot she's the bubble has blown and her face is all kind of smushed and it's awesome. But it's also showing her roller skates, which is super-duper cool. So it tells that. And then there was one other here that I wanted to bring out. Like it's a girl with the round, like kind of John Lening glasses, and she's wearing a knit hat and then it's just different close-ups of her face Magical. It's really great. Like as a parent, I'd absolutely love these shots because it really shows her personality and I can tell you're really zooming into those things, and I think that's what I find really interesting is there's a study images.
Speaker 2:That's a good word. Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1:That, I can tell, comes from your education and the fact that you're really focused on the backgrounds and the colors and it all kind of comes together and it's very feminine, which is obviously easier for female photographers, but it really comes out in your images and I can see where you kind of put that together too. I also love when you show this, also like the study of where you start from a photograph and then kind of create those paintings too. And you can see that in your photography where you're kind of zooming in and there's one of a girl next to the waterfall and then there's kind of three like you bring them in closer in that. Do you know what shot I'm talking about? So it's like the bottom right is of a waterfall and then it kind of gets closer in on her dress as she does.
Speaker 1:And I find it interesting on how there's three final pieces in there. But you're kind of starting with this photograph and then winding up with this painterly image. Is there a process there that you teach and talk about there?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think I'm a natural storyteller. I think that's what comes out in my images, either if it's composite art, digital photo, painting, painting or photography it's. The question is, what's the story I wanna tell? And, of course, if someone's hiring me a senior family I wanna tell the senior story or the family story. But as I watch them, as I'm photographing, I'm watching those little nuances. How does that person look? How does that person look down? When are they truly smiling? What is it that's gonna get them to smile or not? And it's okay if they don't.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I can see that, like I can see that you're asking questions, you're looking and you're finding things in these shots. Does that process begin before you start taking portraits of people, or does it just? I'm gonna figure it out as we go.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I do an intake. If the mom reaches out to me, I like to call and tell me about your senior, tell me about your family. I wanna know some of those things. Are they involved in any activities? Are they shy? Do they even want this photo shoot Cause a lot of? Times especially the sons are like they're doing it for me. I'm like that's okay, that's okay. So I wanna know some of that ahead of time. And then a lot of times you don't know who you're gonna photograph until you show up.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I don't stop my clients, I don't look them up on Facebook. I don't do that. I just try to take some information ahead of time, cool.
Speaker 1:And then I have one last technical question that I wanna hear you talk about your education stuff. It also looks and it's taken me a while to figure it out. It also looks like you don't shoot with a longer lens that much. Looks like you're shooting with a shorter lens I'm guessing anywhere between 50 to 85 millimeters, and I think that helps you get in there closer. Am I wrong?
Speaker 2:I do have a 135 prime. I love.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:And I do that. Those are the ones that I get that beautiful, you know, depth of field from, and I think, because it looks so intimate is because I'm so far back.
Speaker 1:Hmm, okay.
Speaker 2:I'm not that close up to them. I'm actually giving them the space to be them, but I'm further back because that 135 is pretty. You know I have to step way back for that.
Speaker 1:That's interesting. Yeah, you must be okay. All right, I see it now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I see it now yeah.
Speaker 1:All right, so I wanna learn from you.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:How do I do that? I'm a puppy. How do I do that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you can go to my website, carlysellonscom, and there I have different assets you can purchase and download to start learning how to digitally composite your photographs into art. So the art backgrounds that I create are stemming from my painterly background and my love of art history, so these aren't just like run-of-the-mill backgrounds that you can find anywhere. There's a lot of time and thought put in them, like the old master's pack. I really studied old master's painting to get that color tone in the page strokes and so when you are compositing this with your photos, it brings up those two together and creates that painterly look.
Speaker 1:That makes sense, and are you doing any live education anytime soon in person?
Speaker 2:I'll be back at ClickCon next year, for sure.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's the one I know for sure next year.
Speaker 1:All right.
Speaker 2:I'm doing something in Cleveland at the end of December too.
Speaker 1:Nice, back in Cleveland, back in Cleveland. We didn't talk about it, but Carly and I often will discuss our mutual love and admiration for our terrible football teams, the Cleveland Browns and the New York Jets, and quite often we commiserate with each other, because misery loves company, right, and you originally how long have you been in St Louis?
Speaker 2:now?
Speaker 1:It's nine years, I think Nine years okay, okay, cool, all right, well, I think we're gonna end it there. I will make sure to put her websites and URLs and all of that stuff. Carly is a great teacher and had to pull it out of her a little bit but, unlike many of our educators in her industry, has a lot of education under her belt that she can really share with you, and you don't need to go get your master's degree to learn the techniques that she has she's happy to share with you.
Speaker 1:So, again thanks for thanks for being on Something New Every Week this week, kelly.
Speaker 2:Thank you very much for having me, Jason.
Speaker 1:All right, that'll do it for this week's episode. If you'd like to be on our show, I'd love to have you. I'm not a hard person to talk to, so just reach out to me. I'm not hard to find. You can find me and we'll see you on next week's episode of Something New Every Week. Take care everyone. Thanks again for tuning into Something New Every Week. I hope you enjoyed this episode and if you do enjoy these episodes, I love it if you hit that subscribe button on. However, you're listening to this Again. We wanna thank our sponsor, miller's Lab, miller's Labcom great company. If you're not familiar with them, you should go check them out. Thanks again for tuning into Something New Every Week. We will see you back here next week.